WBR and the transfer bar

CraigC:buoa11o4 said:

Yeah well, unfortunately the user is not the only safety concern with automobiles. The problem is everybody else. ALL you have to worry about with a traditional sixgun is carrying the sixgun with the hammer down on an empty chamber. Do it enough and it's completely second nature. If ALL you had to worry about driving a car was ONE THING, the road would be a much safer place. Nope, there are people who just can't drive who have a license to anyway, people on cell phones talking and tex

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CraigC,

What about the points I brought up regarding hunting safety and the better design of the transfer bar?? You seemed to gloss over that.

Anyone and I mean ANYONE who has hunted with both a New Model and Old Model Ruger Blackhawk will tell you that the new model is a far safer design. In this application the transfer bar way exceeds the older design. It has NOTHING to do with the operator.

If you pistol hunt long enough there WILL be times when you will need to let that hammer down because your shot just wasn't there. Now because of an old outdated design you have put yourself in more danger of an accidental discharge than you would had you been using an New Model with the transfer bar. Sorry but the revolver itself is more dangerous without the transfer bar...period.

It is not, and I did not.

If the hammer is drawn back but a shot is not available or not needed, you just lower the hammer to the safety notch, return it to the half cock notch and rotate it until drawing it back again and lowering it will rest the hammer over the empty chamber. It's no different than operating an exposed hammer levergun. If you can't safely manipulate your sixgun with gloves on, then you don't need to be wearing them and it doesn't matter what you're shooting. You follow the basic safety precautions necessary for ANY shooting and any "negligent" discharge will not only be your own fault but it will be safely fired into the ground.

The only valid safety concern is if you are ignorant enough to carry your traditional sixgun with the hammer down on a loaded chamber and something impacts the hammer.

CraigC":1iuw7fx9 said:

It is not, and I did not.

If the hammer is drawn back but a shot is not available or not needed, you just lower the hammer to the safety notch, return it to the half cock notch and rotate it until drawing it back again and lowering it will rest the hammer over the empty chamber. It's no different than operating an exposed hammer levergun. If you can't safely manipulate your sixgun with gloves on, then you don't need to be wearing them and it doesn't matter what you're shooting. You follow the basic safety precautions necessary for ANY shooting and any "negligent" discharge will not only be your own fault but it will be safely fired into the ground.

The only valid safety concern is if you are ignorant enough to carry your traditional sixgun with the hammer down on a loaded chamber and something impacts the hammer.

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And by lowering the hammer to the "safety notch" which we ALL know is NOT a true safety notch you have just put yourself in harms way because if your thumb should slip while doing this, the gun WILL go off. With the transfer bar it wouldn't. Now you have to draw it back to half cock...again if your thumb slips...Bang! Then you have to rotate the cylinder around so that the empty chamber will index into position when you re-cock the revolver. If that half cock should fail (we all know that never happens :roll: ) or you should accidentally drop the revolver...Bang! Again, none of that would not happen if the revolver was equipped with the transfer bar.

As far as manipulating the sixgun with gloves on....Have you ever hunted in Illinois in the middle of December, January, February??? You have two choices, one, wear the glove or two, take it off. Unfortunately BOTH will increase the chance of a misshap. Hands don't work too well with bulky gloves on nor do they in below freezing temps, even after only seconds of exposure. Yet, your asking the operator to manipulate a trigger, hammer and cylinder (multiple times and sometimes two of them at the once) perhaps in a freezing rain or snow in order to move past all those loaded rounds in order to bring the revolver back to a safe position to be carried knowing full well that if there is a misshap, that hammer is going to fall on a loaded round...but in your opinion THAT'S safer than the transfer bar!?

I agree, carrying your Old Model sixgun with the hammer over a loaded cylinder is ignorant but it's more ignorant to believe the Old Model design is better or safer (especially in a hunting situation) than the New Model design.

I'd say the New Model is "inherently safer" but that it's no substitute for knowing what you're doing and doing it properly.

No amount of "safety gadgets" will make up for ignorance and/or carelessness.

Please don't misunderstand, I love the Old Model Blackhawk and I prefer the Old Models lock work. It's just the safety notches are no way near as safe as the transfer bar system. In a regular shooting situation I will always reach for an Old Model but when hunting it's New Models all the way....Just my .02

Ale-8(1)":r15dezei said:

I'd say the New Model is "inherently safer" but that it's no substitute for knowing what you're doing and doing it properly.

No amount of "safety gadgets" will make up for ignorance and/or carelessness.

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I agree 100%

If the shooter is an idiot, he (or she) stands a better chance of hurting themself or somebody else no matter what model is in their hands.

I for one like to be able to load six...I can still load one, skip one, load four...but a full house is nice, even if it's seldom necessary.

Ale-8(1)":1tmqzp0h said:

I'd say the New Model is "inherently safer" but that it's no substitute for knowing what you're doing and doing it properly.

No amount of "safety gadgets" will make up for ignorance and/or carelessness.

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Sad but totally true.

Personally, I think the big bore centerfire revolvers are no big deal to use without a transfer bar.
However, the .22 revolvers, like the OM Single Six and OM Bearcat are a bit more of a pain because you can't look at the side of the revolver and see the rim of the cartridge to tell if there is an empty chamber under the hammer.

Ale-8(1) said:

. . . and don't buy a car with seat belts or anti-lock brakes or safety glass or . . .

:roll:

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Ahh,1957 chrysler 300 with 392 Hemi..leather interior..fins. 375horses..Im in

A 14 year old thread,, wow!

I only have 1 old model and 1 new model. I shoot both of them about the same. The triggers are about the same and not near as good as my S x W 686 trigger. If I were to hunt or carry one of the Blackhawks it would be a new model. I do think they are "safer". I do not care about the "clicks" nor have any use for half cock.

The story that I heard years ago, a man named Harold Nye who lived in New York, but had a business in Alaska came up to go bear hunting. The brush can get ridiculously thick and he was going through it. Apparently a branch caught on the hammer of his 44 mag and when when it slipped off, his SBH went off and he was seriously injured, almost lost his leg.

I've never heard anyone say his name related to the incident, I worked for him years ago and the story I was from people that did work for him and knew him well. I don't know if Nye sued or not, I heard he did, but the truth is, that's what people do that are injured with your product, they sue.

People who own and run businesses do what they have to do to protect their business. They would be dumb not to protect it.

You can criticize all you want, but in the end. The owner would be ignorant to not do anything they can to protect their company. So would any of you.

Oh yes..I totally get why they went transfer bar..Also with many double actions,people by then not as use to carrying gun on empty chamber..In, say,1890, that was normal, many guns then yu needed to carry on empty..I have several from that era,and always have only 5bin them..or 4vif they 5 shot..

I know this is an ancient thread but 10 years later in 2020, I posted a thread about how to tell whether an old model has been converted just by looking at pictures (like in an auction ad) with the hammer down. At the end of that post, I added the following:

TRANSFER BAR TRIVIA!

Q1: What was the first revolver that Ruger offered that incorporated a transfer bar safety? And when?

A1: Were you tempted to guess the New Model Single Six or Blackhawk? In 1973? Nope. The double action Security Six, introduced in 1970 and with prototypes at least as early as 1969, was the first Ruger with a transfer bar.


Q2: Who invented and patented the transfer bar safety? And when?

A2: Were you tempted to guess Ruger in the late 1960's? Nope. The transfer bar safety was invented by a fellow working for Iver Johnson and patented in 1896! Iver Johnson advertised revolvers with this safety using the slogan, "Hammer The Hammer" with a drawing of a claw hammer striking the spur of a revolver hammer as a means to make the point that a blow to the hammer would not result in the firearm discharging.

I guess I was around single actions from at least age 11 or so. Hag a great uncle who was a retired railroad cop who favored the 4 3/4" Colt Single action. e taught me the proper was to load one and I've never changed from that way. Eneve with the new model Rugers I still load as if it was an old model. Simple reason is I have an almost matching pair of Super Blackhawks in .44 Mag. and I just feel it's a good idea to load both equally. Never can tell sometimes when picking one up un a hurry for whatever reason. Not only that but. I think if one has both models, load the safest way for the most dangerous of the pair and that will help keeping onme old models and some new models. I treat the new the same as the old. That way I don't worry about which type is in my hand. Keeps me out of trouble. I have four Colt SAAs,and something like six or seven Rugers, I forget exactly how many. Some are OMs and some are NMs. The old timers knew that if there was gonna be trouble they'd just put a cartridge in that empty chamber. I do the same if hunting. Do whatever works for you.
Paul B.

The implementation of transfer bars in revolvers was primarily a safety measure to prevent accidental discharges. It wasn't just about avoiding lawsuits or planning for future trouble, but rather addressing a real safety concern.
Before transfer bars were introduced, revolvers were often carried with the hammer resting on an empty chamber to prevent accidental discharges. This was because if the hammer was cocked and then dropped, or if it was struck and released, the gun could fire.
The transfer bar system prevents this by placing a bar between the hammer and the firing pin. The bar is only raised into position when the trigger is pulled, so if the hammer is dropped or struck, it will hit the frame instead of the firing pin, preventing the gun from firing.

Ale-8(1) said:

Actually, the transfer-bar system was around for a long time before Ruger incorporated it into his guns. It was used by at least a couple of manufacturers earlier . . . I'm sure somebody will come along and tell us which ones.

WBR's real contribution was to use it in all his revolvers (except the Old Army) and to offer the free conversion for all the Old Models.

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If memory serves, Iver Johnson did the first patent way back in the day. Then when Charter Arms got going about 1965 by McClenahan (a former Ruger engineer), he also had a transfer bar in his D.A. After that came out, Ruger actually started on his on D.A. with the transfer bar... couldn't get it to work properly at the time so started working on several different lockworks on his Single Actions. The very first true transfer bar, very close to what it looks like today, was actually done in a Bearcat... before the original Super Bearcat was discontinued.
Chet15

I think I had an H&R 22 double action revolver that looked like a single action that had a transfer bar in the ea4rly seventies. I bought it used, probably made in the sixties.
I tend to avoid revolvers that do not have transfer bars.