KurtC
Single-Sixer
The NATO StanAg is based upon energy. It must break 400 ft-lbs from a 20cm barrel (7.85"). This puts most compliant ammunition in the +P range. I've fired the M1152 out of several pistols. It is hot.
Are they still subsonic when fired through the longer barrel?115 grain in pistols - JHP's for carry.
147 grain subsonic for PCC - because I usually shoot them suppressed.
"Should Be" - I load them down - never measured them. GREAT question.Are they still subsonic when fired through the longer barrel?
What is the powder charge and type,if you don't mind.."Should Be" - I load them down - never measured them. GREAT question.
You have to be careful with that bullet style,if you load them to the usual OAL , they can get stuck in the leade.Been using these for awhile now. You can't beat the quality or price.
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This is a completely misleading statement about the power of the 9mm cartridge, especially when comparing it to the .357 Mag. The 9mm is essentially a pea shooter of ammo. Here are the facts: (1) the average 9mm ft. lbs. (its power rating) is 362. Corbon make 2 different 9mm 115 gr rounds of ammo - one with 399 ft. lbs., and the other with 466 ft. lbs., and both of these are considerably more powerful than the average 9mm. The MAX power of any 9mm is made by Buffalo Bore, and it delivers 500 ft. lbs. (2) Corbon makes two .357 Mag rounds of ammo with 125gr bullets. One produces 469 ft. lbs and the other produces 544 ft. lbs. But Corbon does NOT make powerful .357 Mag ammo at all. So, in your statement, there is indeed one Corbon 115 gr 9mm ammo that comes close to the lower end of the Corbon .357 Mag round in power, which is not indicative of these calibers at all! If you take this utterly narrow viewpoint, you could then say that the .22 Mag is more powerful than the 9mm! The average .357 Mag round delivers 539 ft. lbs. Buffalo Bore make one with 899 ft. lbs, and PPU makes one with 907 ft. lbs. There is NO comparison between 9mm and the .357 Mag.When I bought my Sig 228 in 90-91 I also bought a bunch of Corbon 115's @1350 fps. I've read that .357 125 gn pushed a bit faster were the ultimate man stoppers and the Corbon 115's are nipping on the magnums heels. Figured they would serve admirably if called upon for serious social work. I've fired a good amount of it over the years and still have a good amount left. I don't hunt with 9mm and would use heavier bullets for that task but for what the Sig is reserved for the 115's should do their job just fine and as accurate as any other quality ammo that I've fired over the years.
Wow, you really got yourself worked up you really didnt comprehend what I typed. I based my whole post on what was going on in my head about 30 years ago. At that time most of these newer .357 rounds weren't born yet and the .357 leader in one shot stops( against two legged predators) was a 125g @ about 1450. Think the stop percentage was in the mid 90% range.This is a completely misleading statement about the power of the 9mm cartridge, especially when comparing it to the .357 Mag. The 9mm is essentially a pea shooter of ammo. Here are the facts: (1) the average 9mm ft. lbs. (its power rating) is 362. Corbon make 2 different 9mm 115 gr rounds of ammo - one with 399 ft. lbs., and the other with 466 ft. lbs., and both of these are considerably more powerful than the average 9mm. The MAX power of any 9mm is made by Buffalo Bore, and it delivers 500 ft. lbs. (2) Corbon makes two .357 Mag rounds of ammo with 125gr bullets. One produces 469 ft. lbs and the other produces 544 ft. lbs. But Corbon does NOT make powerful .357 Mag ammo at all. So, in your statement, there is indeed one Corbon 115 gr 9mm ammo that comes close to the lower end of the Corbon .357 Mag round in power, which is not indicative of these calibers at all! If you take this utterly narrow viewpoint, you could then say that the .22 Mag is more powerful than the 9mm! The average .357 Mag round delivers 539 ft. lbs. Buffalo Bore make one with 899 ft. lbs, and PPU makes one with 907 ft. lbs. There is NO comparison between 9mm and the .357 Mag.
I have created a ballistics file that covers 35 handgun calibers (and 25 rifle ones), with over 3,500 entries, where each entry is a link to an online retailer for that particular ammo. It contains about 200 unique 9mm entries (not duplicate ammo that is sold by different outlets), and for the .357 Mag caliber there are a little over 100 unique .357 Mag rounds listed. This is how I get my averages. If interested in this file, message me and I will send you this file (a PDF file).
Well, it is nice to hear that your intent was not to glorify the 9mm, like so many people actually do here and elsewhere online, especially in the YouTube videos! But your words came across otherwise, especially when you were comparing the 9mm to the .357 Mag. Nor did I make any comment about hunting. I can only read and respond to your words, and not your intent. But I have been shooting .357 Mag ammo since 1965 (Ruger Blackhawk 6.5"), and it was VERY powerful back then as well. Keep in mind, that it was the MOST powerful handgun in the world from 1934 to the advent of the .44 Mag in 1955 - that's 21 years. I do not have any detailed ballistics on ammo sold back in the '60s, or even just 30 years ago, but from personal experience, the heavy loads of the .357 Mag gave a huge kick back then, as the rounds do now. I remember shooting at dusk back then, and it shot out a flame of about 1.5-2 feet! I started collecting ballistics ammo statistics 8 years ago - 2015. Again, if you would like to see this ballistics file, just PM me, and I can email it to you, or tell you how to get from my website online. If you buy ammo, this is a nice source of info to have.Wow, you really got yourself worked up you really didnt comprehend what I typed. I based my whole post on what was going on in my head about 30 years ago. At that time most of these newer .357 rounds weren't born yet and the .357 leader in one shot stops( against two legged predators) was a 125g @ about 1450. Think the stop percentage was in the mid 90% range.
the Corbons were 115 @ 1350 with 466 ftlbs and an almost equal stopping rate of the vaunted magnum. That's why I bought a bunch of it then, still have some and don't feel undergunned with it one bit, even 30+ years later.
No where did I even hint at solid hard cast, high pressured bear defense stuff and other very hot, heavy projectile modern ammo, I wasn't talking about averages along the whole range of the particular ammunition I was comparing apples to apples of two front leaders in man stoppers from 30 years ago and you're throwing in bananas and bicycle wheels, totally irrelevant to the point I was making.
Again I was comparing in the time frame of 3 decades ago when the two specific 357/9mm were compared head to head in armed man on man situations. My words were not at all misleading as I prefaced it by stating long, long time ago. You're the one who mentioned BB and PPU at high 800 to 900 ft lbs not me, those aren't target rounds or personal rounds. They're large game stoppers plain and simple.Well, it is nice to hear that your intent was not to glorify the 9mm, like so many people actually do here and elsewhere online, especially in the YouTube videos! But your words came across otherwise, especially when you were comparing the 9mm to the .357 Mag. Nor did I make any comment about hunting. I can only read and respond to your words, and not your intent. But I have been shooting .357 Mag ammo since 1965 (Ruger Blackhawk 6.5"), and it was VERY powerful back then as well. Keep in mind, that it was the MOST powerful handgun in the world from 1934 to the advent of the .44 Mag in 1955 - that's 21 years. I do not have any detailed ballistics on ammo sold back in the '60s, or even just 30 years ago, but from personal experience, the heavy loads of the .357 Mag gave a huge kick back then, as the rounds do now. I remember shooting at dusk back then, and it shot out a flame of about 1.5-2 feet! I started collecting ballistics ammo statistics 8 years ago - 2015. Again, if you would like to see this ballistics file, just PM me, and I can email it to you, or tell you how to get from my website online. If you buy ammo, this is a nice source of info to have.
Your words were completely misleading, although apparently not to you. But for just about any reader, they will be, as you can see from my response. And there was NO mention of hunting in my response, just what the average and max's are for each caliber, showing how much differences there are between the two calibers. And as for your constantly thinking that there weren't particularly powerful .357 Mag rounds then, the INITIAL caliber made in 1934 was a 158gr bullet traveling at 1525 fps, which delivered 688 ft. lbs. Of course, many variants have been made since, many less powerful and some a lot more.Again I was comparing in the time frame of 3 decades ago when the two specific 357/9mm were compared head to head in armed man on man situations. My words were not at all misleading as I prefaced it by stating long, long time ago. You're the one who mentioned BB and PPU at high 800 to 900 ft lbs not me, those aren't target rounds or personal rounds. They're large game stoppers plain and simple.
Heres a similar list I was looking at 30 years ago to decide what to buy at that time. Good amount of these cartridges weren't even developed then but the somewhat slower Corbon 115 still has a very good 1 shot stop number without passing through 8 humans behind the skell who's targeted with one of those grizz planter 900 ftlb rounds!